Saturday, 7 July 2012

Kilkenny CONDR*Ns

County Kilkenny lies in the Irish province of Leinster. It is bordered on the north by Co. Laois or Leix (Queens County), on the east by Co. Carlow and Co. Wexford, on the south by Co. Waterford and on the west by Co. Tipperary.
CONDR*Ns are uncommon in Co. Kilkenny, but historically there are some living there: between 1864 (when universal civil registration of births, marriages and deaths began in Ireland) and 1910, a span of 46 years, there were 23 CONDR*N births registered, 13 marriages and 18 deaths. Fifty of these life events were recorded in the Castlecomer registration district, which covers the north-east corner of the county, and the remaining 4 events in the Kilkenny registration district which covers a band from west to east across the northern half of the county. This geographical restriction to the northern part of the county lends support to the idea that the Kilkenny CONDR*Ns perhaps migrated from Queens County. The most common variant of CONDR*N to be found in Co. Kilkenny is CONDREN.

Although I have not yet fitted all nineteenth-century Kilkenny CONDR*Ns into family trees, those found there in the 1901 and 1911 censuses are mostly accounted for. In each of 1901 and 1911, there are five households in the county containing CONDR*Ns, in addition to one nun in 1901 and two nuns in 1911 who were living in religious houses in the county but were born in Co. Wicklow. Apart from a widow Margaret CONDRON who is living in Clogh in both 1901 and 1911, and a widower Martin CONDRON living in Greenshill in 1901, all households in the censuses are related to just two married couples. Although they are variously spelt CONDREN and CONDRON in the censuses, in what follows I use the spelling CONDREN throughout.

The first couple is Brian (sometimes recorded as Bernard) CONDREN, who married Mary COLLINS in the Roman Catholic parish of Muckalee, Co. Kilkenny, in 1861. I believe that the following 14 children are theirs: Bridget (1861), Ellen (1863), Mary (1865), Margaret (1866), Edward (1868), Anne (1870), Michael (1871), Martin (1873), Bernard (1876), Margaret (1878), Bernard or Brian (1880), Thomas (1882), James (1884) and Patrick James (1887). Brian CONDREN senior died before 1901, but his widow Mary is found in the 1901 census with her daughter Mary and sons Michael, Martin and Bernard. Mary CONDREN senior died in 1904. In 1911, son Michael is living with his wife Mary (nee HARDING), whom he married in Clogh in 1907, and their three children. Martin, who is recorded as a widow (he may have married a Bridget HARDING - Mary's sister, perhaps? - in 1908, in which case she probably died in 1910), is living with his brothers Bernard and Thomas. All these households are living in the townland of Chatsworth, near Clogh. Another son, Edward, is living with his wife Mary (nee BROPHY), whom he married in Castlecomer in 1901, in the townland of Croghtenclogh with their three children. All these places are less than a mile from the border with Queens County.

The second couple is also - confusingly - Brian (sometimes recorded as Bernard) CONDREN, who married Bridget FOGARTY in 1873. I believe they had two children: John (1876) and Thomas (1878). By 1901, Brian has died and his widow Bridget and son John are living in the townland of Uskerty, together with Brian's sister Eliza. By 1911, Eliza has died but Mary and her son John are still living in Uskerty. Two years later, in 1913, John married a Julia BANIM in Coon, Co. Kilkenny, and their descendants now live in Ireland, England and Australia. I am grateful to correspondent Kathy Clare who has given me information about this CONDREN line.

As always, I would welcome any corrections or additional information about the topic of this post: email condran [AT] .


irishprincesscaitlin97 said...

The Mary (nee brophy ) you mentioned I believe I am related to her she may have been an aunt of my great grandmother

Michael Thompson said...

Thanks for your feedback!

bersky01 said...

John condron and Julia banim were my grandparents, they had Tom,john,martin,bridie and Josie I hope I haven't missed anyone. My mother was Margaret who married Dennis Hogan and emigrated to Australia in 1968. Margaret passed away in November 1988. She had three children Colin, Tom and bernadette ( me) bernadette married Stephen skurray and had two boys Liam born July 2001 and Marcus born Feb 2004. Colin married Julie Finlayson and had 3 children Shannon born 1988 annalise 1990 and Andrew 1992? Tom did not have children.

Michael Thompson said...

Bernadette, Thank you so much for posting this information about John and Julia (BANIM)'s descendants. If you email me directly (, I'll be happy to pass on what I know from another correspondent about John and Julia's other descendants.

Kieran Keyes said...

Thanks Michael. Thats a very informative post.

Bernard Condren and Mary Collins (your 1st Condren couple) were my great great grandparents. Their daughter Ellen (that you also mention) was my great grandmother and she married Henry (Harry) Poole from Coan East Co.Kilkenny. Their daughter in turn, Margaret Poole was my grandmother and she married Lawrence Keyes from Chatsworth Co.Kilkenny. Margaret Poole (Keyes) lived her married life in Moyadd, Co.Laois, just a stones throw from the Kilkenny/Laois border.

With best wishes

Kieran F.Keyes

Pat Kelly said...

Hi Everyone,
My great grand mother was Ellen Kelly nee Collins married to James Kelly the Bridge Croghtenclough sister of Mary Condron the lived about a half mile apart.
They were members of the Collins family from The Ballagh Rd near Coon village.
Google Croghtenclough and search photos on top of page you will see a photo of Ellen.
Pat Kelly.